Janet CollinsBlogging Etiquette
April 20th 2009 21:34
As blogging is relatively new there have been no real rules in etiquette when it comes to commenting on blogs. This doesn’t mean that there is not an etiquette that should be applied to the whole genre of blogging.
While there is nothing set in concrete, contributing to blogs should really include etiquette. Firstly, there is the moderator (or writer) to consider. A moderator, or writer, of a blog often goes to a lot of trouble to write up material that has been researched, written and edited. What most bloggers hope to achieve is as much traffic to their site as they can muster. They don't want angry and uncalled for comments that detract from the topic they are writing about.
If you want to make a career of being a commentator on blogs, I would suggest that you should honour a few rules, in respect for the person running the blog and the people wanting to visit it.
Firstly, stick to the topic. The person who has written a post on their blog has invested a lot of time (mostly) in researching and writing the post. Most bloggers love traffic, but they want traffic and comments that can debate about the topic they have written about.
Everyone has a different view on a lot of subjects. Blogs invite these different comments. The trouble is a lot of people who make comments do not stick to the topic and get sidelined about peripheral issues or personal accusations against other people offering comments.
This is a difficult situation for a blog moderator to control. If you want to contribute to blogging sites and even blog on newspaper articles, think of a few things.
First, respect the moderator (writer) of the blog.
Secondly, keep the comments and arguments related to the topic.
Thirdly, always understand that others will have a different point of view to your own.
Fourth, don’t take an opposite view as being an insult.
Fifth: If you can't say something constructive, refrain from commenting at all.
Blogging is not so new but it is new enough not to have built any rules around it. Common courtesy should always be kept in mind and when debating, debate the issues not the people who have commented on the site.
If we keep to these guidelines, blogging will have hopefully a much better reputation than it does now. A lot of opinions on the internet can be very interesting indeed. These opinions should be considered before writing them because that is what will make blogging an art form.
Isn’t that what we all want?
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Comment by Anonymous
If people didn't agonise so much or invest so much time in their posts or comments, they'd write as they think and speak.
It's not really that hard to write a blog post. Half of the bloggers are trying so hard to prove themselves as journalists with cred, they forget they're only bloggers.
Over and above that? Too many bloggers are trying to come across as squeaky clean when their comments betray them.
So, I'm a headcase. Yeah? Tell me something I don't know. If you ban all the people from blogging who entertain everyone, Orble will degenerate into a fat woman's creche. Bored, downtrodden housewives sitting on here all day long whingeing about how men have mistreated them in life. All agreeing with each other that men are bastards. Yet secretly reading romance novels and wishing they had hooked up with a man with spirit.
You don't believe me? Get back to me when you're a bit older and see who was right.
I like the social interaction of blogging. So I'll come across people I don't agree with. Who rub me up the wrong way. Will I take a step backwards? Hardly. Will everyone think I'm a headcase? Mainly. But if blogging is just about people pretending to be nice, why don't they all hire Mary Poppins or the Sound of Music?
I mean, you write some interesting posts, but Orble always degenerates into Orble and blogging, and people lose sight of why they joined the site.
Women will go and watch a film with fucking in it, and swearing in it, then come on Orble and go, this is totally unacceptable. I have a name for people like that. Hypocrites. People with so little self-knowledge I'm surprised they recognise themselves in the mirror. And when you consider self-worship is king and queen on orble, that's almost surprising. But human nature will never surprise me. It can plunge into the depths of depravity or rise on wings to the height of beauty, but we're all made of the same substance.
Comment by Janet Collins
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There is certainly nothing wrong with having an opposing view and I think I made my thoughts on that clear in my post. It is quite another thing to resort to attacks, foul comments and vitriol. The cleverest of writers manage to incorporate information, wit and interest in their blogs, comments or columns without having to drag in any of the above.
Thanks for the comment.
Comment by Cheryl J
Rhythmatism
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Opposing views on the subject addressed can make for interesting reading - a good debate can be fabulous to read and participate in. Personal mudslinging and taking things in a wildly different direction does not make for interesting reading.
I myself was guilty of taking your post off topic by addressing David on something I found to be disrespectful on your post. I should have contacted him directly and said so. For that, I owe you an apology.
I'm loving the new site by the way!
Comment by Mau-Medellin
Mau-Medellin
I think the site would benefit from a code of conduct, something that all bloggers are required to adhere to... This could cover things such label, and victimisation.
It's certainly a sign of the times, and as much bad press as Gen Y are getting, it seems the older generations are just as guilty of having lost respect for others.
I think it's time for people to take a big spoon full of medicine, and start considering the impact of their words before spouting off. Reading some of the comments on your Airline post Janet was like being shot in the head with a Cannon firing rolled up junk mail pamphlets.
I applaud you for having the courage to make a stand, when inevitably you will come under fire from the vile pair, David & Teresa, who feel so threatened by the mere notion of etiquette and good manners.
Comment by Janet Collins
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This is really the point. No-one, particularly me, worries if views are totally opposed to my own so long as the views presented are not personal insults.
Thank you for the comment.
Comment by Janet Collins
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The subject of a code of conduct was raised once before but most were against it. Most thought we were mature enough to self-audit our posts and our comments.
I wish this were true. Nevertheless, the internet is really pretty free for anyone to do what they like and some take this to a new level.
Thanks you for the comment and the compliment.
Comment by moonglow
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Comment by Janet Collins
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You raise a few good points. Often people start having goes at each other on a blog for no particular reason. Some times this can be totally in fun. Other times it is just a nuisance. It is always a quantry for a moderator of a blog. Do you delete offensive comments or do you let them stand? It is really interesting that there are offensive comments at all. Thank you for the comment.
Comment by Janet Collins
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Thank you. I hope they are of use.
Comment by sam sall
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it is really disappointing and upsetting for everyone when the topic discussion turned into personal or offensive attacks
Comment by Jason King
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Morgan - didn't you once upon a time write rules for bloggin on Orble - did anything ever come of those?
Janet - you have raised a very important issue infecting Orble and certain Orblers at the moment. I must agree that sometimes I leave disrespectful comments on my blog as I do not wish to get involved in conflict, so I just ignore them. I hate it - but I do love debating and different points of view - it's what makes us all different and interesting.
If we don't sort out the issue and if the Orble owners don't do something more to cement in rules and adhere to them then we may lose a lot of readers and or bloggers to sites that do respect these rules.
Comment by JohnDoe
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Comment by Morgan Bell
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yes i brought up a similar issues Nov 08 predicting the situation would deteriorate when no explicit guidelines existed on the site . . . i was largely laughed out of town for suggesting Jon might want to revise and enforce the terms and conditions
heres the link anyway:
Really Long Link
many people make sensible constructive comments and then a few of the usual suspects jump on and turn it into a circus
Jon issued a statement later the same month offering a complaints email, but none of the other suggestions were ever acted upon
heres a link to that one:
Really Long Link
Comment by Lilla
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great post : I really like Point 4 and 5.
Lilla . .
Comment by Morgan Bell
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i dont really think one post on the Writers Forum over six months ago could really be defined as a series of tantrums
and i have seen you request a block button yourself so i dont know why you are trying to insinuate i would be the sole beneficiary of such a measure . . . another person who has requested the function is Cheryl
Comment by Mau-Medellin
Mau-Medellin
Reading the comments on this thread makes me feel very sorry for Janet, who is trying her utmost to raise the civility level on this site; only to have everyone say things like I didn't start it, so it's not my fault!
Fact is, we're all adults, and each and everyone of us are responsible for our own actions. Regardless of who said what first.
Lets not force Janet into mediating a situation which could be controlled is ALL exercised just a little restraint... and showed each other even the most basic level of courtesy.
My Mum, as I'm sure many other's also say, says "If you don't have something nice to say, don't say anything at all." And I think the sentiment there is exactly what Janet is trying to get across in her post.
Janet, you have my full support, and as I said, I admire you for having the courage to make a stand even though you know you'll find yourself in the firing line.
Mau-Medellin
Comment by Nevar
Is Why
Hahahaha . . M n M, there has been months of well measured discourse and still, it hasn't produced real change.
The self righteous remain wounded, the bully remains the victim and the would be maven remain sycophants.
If change is to occur, don't look for it to happen over night or in the face of personal rancor; I dislike the anecdotal golden rule, s/he who has the gold makes the rules or sleeps with the boss.
Sorry, I waffled, I was afraid to suggest that we adhere to a rule which in Christian speak goes like this; treat others as you want to be treated.
Kindness begets puppies and asexual good will.
Comment by Mau-Medellin
Mau-Medellin
Comment by Lilla
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I have transferred my comment to my blog (ordinary Life), where it belongs, if you have views people, come and air them.
Janet, my central question is this ;
If someone attacks me and calls me names in *public* (as it were) in their comment on someone elses blog (like yours recently), because (a) they don*t like me, or (b) they are misinformed or (c) just plain nasty, am I allowed to defend myself in return?
I mean someone vilifies me publicly, yet I don*t have the right to defend myself publicly to counter inaccurate charges laid at my door because some new Orble commandment will tell me I just have to grin and ignore it, to pass on to arbitration? Yet unlike a verbal comment which dissipates into the ether in the real world, in here, this comment will stand through time undefended, un proven, casting its shadowy doubt and defamation on my character without a counter argument being made?
I would never agree to it, nor would anyone else.
Perhaps it has gotten to the stage that Nevar suggests : Leave a comment and a private email address for those wishing to respond if they disagree?
Drive by comment and run?
I would value your views on this aspect of the problem.
Lilla ...
Comment by samaritan
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I think it comes down to respect. We should all aim to treat people with respect all the time - whether it's online or in the real world. But you can't really make a whole heap of rules that guarantee people will be respectful.
When you're talking to someone in real life, there's a chance they're not going to be respectful. But that's just life. I think it's just important for each person to make sure they treat others with respect - and just hope that they treat you with respect back.
Samaritan
Comment by Cheryl J
Rhythmatism
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I read the comment made before it was withdrawn regarding Morgan's 'tantrums' on the subject. I thought that was tasteless and uncalled for. Morgan happened to write a post (which I was in the midst of writing myself at the time but she beat to the punch) regarding rules on Orble. I don't think the post in question was in any way a tantrum as many of the respondents agreed it was a good idea.
Do I like Morgan? Yes. Do I agree with everything she writes? No. Do I think she has been subjected to cyberbullying? Yes. Before you jump on your high horses and say she is guilty of the same, for the last few weeks almost every blog I have clicked on and read that she had made a comment on, David had followed her and subjected her to a barrage of personal abuse that had nothing to do with the subject at hand. I don't think that anyone deserves that.
Alt-ed was just as bad, doing the same to other people. It is not right, nor is it adult behaviour. It has been said that adults should be able to self-monitor, well in a perfect that would be the case. This is obviously far from a perfect world.
I have watched a site that I used to enjoy participating in degenerate into something, that if I were a casual surfer who happened upon the site, would avoid like the plague.
I have never wanted to enter into any form of personal warfare on this site. I have no problem with people voicing differing opinions. This is something altogether different.
I have been weighing up in the last couple of weeks whether to continue participating at all on Orble and this has just made up my mind for me. Nothing will change.
I'm sure 99% of you couldn't give a damn if I blog here or not and that is fine. I enjoyed my small readership and engaging with others but I don't enjoy it anymore. I will be blogging on a site which takes abuse seriously and has measures already in place to deal with it. Yes it has 'report abuse' buttons which was one of the first questions I asked when I joined. They seemed quite bewildered that I had asked as it is the norm everywhere else.
Janet, it has always been a pleasure to read your posts.
Comment by Jason King
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And whoever wrote this:
Why not delete their comment and go gangbusters on the personal message
Everyone - let's have an Orble party in Sydney - everyone can come along and we can hire those sumo costumes and beat the crap out of each other. Then we can get drunk, hug, cry and be friends for years
Comment by Lilla
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I didn*t remove it completely, I did post a note to say I had moved it to my blog, as I realised that by saying that about Morgan (voicing my opinion) I was once again invading Janet*s blog, and do agree that it is wrong. However, I was caught for time at the time, and had to leave the house quickly to pick up children ~ left it there ~ and then removed it later. (I shoudl have put it in a word doc, but was also caught up in the sadness of what orble has degenrated to since 2006, when I first came on here and it was a literal paradise of prose, poetry, art and brilliantly written personal pieces of wonderful literature and comedy, from aspiring writers who reflected their real lives in some of the most moving pieces I have read anywhere : inspiring as they did all on orble to higher goals and many successes with some writers published in the interim. Many great writers ~ particularly David ~ but he removed them all when things started to head south with the new wave of *experts* that arrived.
I will miss your cheerful posts if you go.
Jason,
I made the comment and you missed the point dear one. Not to drag it out of the past, where it should be left by adding a link to it (because that is hateful), but someone attacked me on Janet*s post, where I neither have the right nor the ability to delete anything. So I wondered if we have the right say, if someone called me a moron on one of your posts to defend myself on your post, as commentors on others blogs . . you know, to defend ourselves, with respect to the moderator, perhaps by excusing ourselves and then bringing the original post subject back into context afterwards?
Lilla . .
Comment by Janet Collins
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Thank you. I really don't think there is anything wrong with voicing a completely different view but that is very different to a personal attack.
Thanks for the comment.
Comment by Janet Collins
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I guess I should feel pretty good that I have gone up in your estimation but while commenting you couldn't seem to resist slandering another writer. That is exactly the point I am making.
Whenever I refer to another writer/blogger, it is because I am recommending what they write, not chastising them. And the comments you made aren't about what they have written but personal insults. I find that offensive and immature.
It certainly doesn't make our blogs attractive to outsiders who don't know what everyone is going on about.
Thanks for the comment anyway.
Janet
Comment by Janet Collins
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There is absolutely no problem with debating different points of view. That is what makes blogging interesting and lively. It is a different thing to continually slander bloggers.
We are all doing it for different reasons. Maybe it is to just show off our writing skills, our knowledge or just to have good debates online.
Everyone should get some respect from their fellow bloggers. Personal attacks shouldn't come into it.
Thanks for the comment.
Comment by Janet Collins
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Thanks for the compliment and thanks for dropping by. It is interesting times.
Janet
Comment by Janet Collins
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I do remember your proposal and I put my two bits in for that too.
I got the feeling then that although some were upset by what was going on in Orble that others felt we would be responsible enough to self-edit and therefore it would be in effect curtailing free speech.
Besides that, we just have the option of deleting comments or installing a vetting button.
Thanks
Janet
Comment by Jason King
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Why can't we all just get along?
Comment by Janet Collins
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You are so right. It is also understandable that you shake your head. If anyone isn't up with the whole us-versus-them scenaria it would make you shake your head.
Just keep blogging and don't get caught up with the personality clashes. There's no point.
Thanks for visiting.
Janet
Comment by Nevar
Is Why
Comment by Mau-Medellin
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Comment by Janet Collins
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I agree but I also think that any person shouldn't use another person's blog for a personal slant against someone else. I am not saying that people shouldn't be able to defend themselves, I am only saying that that situation shouldn't happen in the first place.
Blogs and comments should be about the subjects, not the person and different viewpoints should be welcome. However, personal attacks are a different thing.
Thanks, I think no 4 and 5 are good too.
Comment by Janet Collins
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That just says it all, Samaritan. I can't add too much to that because you have said it in a nutshell.
Thanks.
Comment by Janet Collins
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More people than you know would miss you posting on Orble. I think you give yourself less credit than you are worth.
But blogbing is blogging and we have to put up with the downsides as well as he upsides. Pity because there are such good writers/loggers out there and the other stuff just gets in the way.
Cheers
Janet
Comment by Janet Collins
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Cheers,
Janet
Comment by Lawrie
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Lawrie
Hi! I'm new to this site and also to blogging and therefore I was delighted to come across this post, or blog. (I'm still getting mixed up between posts and blogs).
You make some very good points and have presented them in a calm and methodical manner.
I agree with all you have to say and may I add something that my mother taught me over sixty years ago and which I still use to this day:
Always treat others as you yourself would like to be treated.
Thanks for putting this up and although your good self and others will always follow those rules of etiquette there will, unfortunately, be others who will always blieve it is machismo to spew forth bile and filth, especialy when they are "losing" the debate in question.
Comment by Janet Collins
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Thank you very much for your kind comments. Orble is my first blogging experience too and I have learned a lot about it since the start. It gives me a chance to write and thinking about what to write about is always interesting.
Some things however you will just need to tolerate. We all self publish but some just can't help either being rude or vulgar or both. Keep with it though. It is a good experience.
Re: the blog or the post? One of your blogs is Political World and the articles you write on that blog are called posts.
Thanks for dropping in.
Janet